2022-05-28 12:46 EDT

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IDProjectCategoryView StatusLast Update
0003125FSSCPturretspublic2021-01-10 01:39
Assigned To 
StatusclosedResolutionunable to reproduce 
Product Version3.7.2 
Target VersionFixed in Version 
Summary0003125: Difference in turret firing arcs between Hades retail model and Hades MVP model
DescriptionThere seems to be a discrepancy in the turret targeting code between single-part turrets and multi-part turrets. According to Yarn's testing, the MVP Hades has trouble targeting cruisers that are 45 degrees or more away from the turret normal. The turret tries to aim, but doesn't fire. The retail Hades model, which uses single-part turrets, can fire at all ships within its firing arc just fine.
Additional InformationAttached is the mission that Yarn created for testing the firing arc of the Hades's ventral cannon. It can be used with no mods or with the MVP mod.
TagsNo tags attached.
Attached Files




Yarn (developer)

I updated the test mission to actually equip the Hades' cannons with beam weapons (SFReds instead of SSLBeams, which exist only in FSPort). I also added a test for the port cannon.

Regarding the ventral cannon, the behavior with the retail (non-MVP) FS2 model is a bit different: the cannon has a lot of trouble firing (but not aiming) at the far corner ships (55 and 71 degrees). I think this might have to do with the beam weapon being used, but I'm not sure. With the 2014 MediaVPs, the situation is similar, except the cannon also doesn't fire at the 45-degree ships. (I need to check retail to see whether the behavior with the retail model is the same there.)

I have also attached an FSPort version of the test mission to provide the circumstances that I originally tested with (such as the use of SSLBeam).


VA (reporter)

Ok I know why the port cannon wasn't firing at all targets - I originally set up the two side guns with rotational restrictions that made sense for the physical turret housing, forgetting to make them compatible with the retail. As such it had a vertical firing arc that was narrower than retail.

Here's a corrected version, which is able to shoot down all the port-cannon's targets in Yarn's test mission. It does have some slight clipping issues because of the corrected fire arc where the turret arm will sometimes intersect geometry it shouldn't, but oh well. Can't have everything. :P


The ventral turret is definitely not a similar problem though. That one does appear to be a code bug, cos as has been described, even the retail one refuses to fire on the ones in the corners of the grid, despite being able to aim at them.


Yarn (developer)

I tested the mission in retail (and had to break it into two missions to prevent retail from crashing). The retail model's ventral cannon behaved pretty much the same there as it does in FSO. In both cases, using cheats to destroy the 71-degree targets allowed the cannon to fire at the 55-degree targets.

I also tested the port cannon. In that test, the retail model in both retail and FSO destroyed all targets. The MVP model, on the other hand, only destroyed the 0- and 25-degree targets and a few 63-degree targets, but nothing else. Fortunately, VA's corrected Hades fixes this, allowing the Hades to destroy all targets.

I still need to do further testing to find out why the retail Hades' ventral cannon can destroy all targets in the FSPort mission but not the FS2 mission.


Yarn (developer)

I did some more testing. Changing to the SSLBeam from FSPort had no effect on what targets the ventral cannon fired at. Changing to the FSPort non-MVP Hades model without editing the ships table, however, did allow the cannon to destroy all targets--but only in FSO. In retail, the FSPort model behaved the same way as the standard model did (that is, it didn't attack the far-corner targets).


VA (reporter)

The retail Hades has a dorsal turret FOV of 160°. It seems the non-MVP FSPort Hades model has changed this to 180°, which is why it's more able to shoot things than the MVP or retail one. In fact all the multi-part turrets have been upped to 180°.

I'm...a little reluctant to follow suit though with the MVP Hades without good reason though - I would be more inclined to suggest the non-MVP FSPort version be changed to match retail. That way you'll have more consistent behaviour between them, AND closer compatibility with retail.

BTW, do you know of any difference between the Hades model in the FSU folder and the Hades in the FSPort MVPs folder? I'm not sure why it's in there twice, as it was built to be compatible with Silent Threat Reborn in the first place - So the one in the main FSU folder should work correctly with STR.


Yarn (developer)

To answer your third paragraph:

"BTW, do you know of any difference between the Hades model in the FSU folder and the Hades in the FSPort MVPs folder?"

I have no idea how they're different; all I know is that they are not bit-for-bit identical.

"I'm not sure why it's in there twice, as it was built to be compatible with Silent Threat Reborn in the first place"

I'm not completely certain why the model is in the FSPort MVPs; it was added back in 2011, well before the 2014 MediaVPs were released, so I'm guessing the FSPort team wanted players to be able to enjoy it without waiting for the next MVP version.

"So the one in the main FSU folder should work correctly with STR."

Remember that the model in the current MVP release has a narrower firing arc for its port and starboard cannons than the retail model does; this is what your altered model fixes. I don't see any reason to hesitate with it.


FSCyborg (developer)

Asteroth's testing has found no difference, closing.


Goober5000 (administrator)

To elaborate a bit: I just checked and the retail Hades has a FOV of 160° on all its turrets, while the MVP Hades has the same FOV on all turrets *except* the port and starboard multipart turrets which have a FOV of 280° (!). I'll change this on the MVP model.

-Issue History
Date Modified Username Field Change
2014-10-18 13:37 Goober5000 New Issue
2014-10-18 13:37 Goober5000 File Added: HadesBeamTest.fs2
2014-10-18 17:24 Yarn File Deleted: HadesBeamTest.fs2
2014-10-18 17:24 Yarn File Added: HadesBeamTest.fs2
2014-10-18 17:26 Yarn File Added: HadesBeamTest-FSPort.fs2
2014-10-18 17:41 Yarn Note Added: 0016341
2014-10-18 22:31 VA Note Added: 0016343
2014-10-19 00:19 Yarn Note Added: 0016344
2014-10-29 17:03 Yarn Note Added: 0016363
2014-11-01 19:16 VA Note Added: 0016372
2014-11-05 23:18 Yarn Note Added: 0016376
2021-01-09 02:07 FSCyborg Status new => closed
2021-01-09 02:07 FSCyborg Resolution open => unable to reproduce
2021-01-09 02:07 FSCyborg Note Added: 0017049
2021-01-10 01:39 Goober5000 Note Added: 0017099
+Issue History